our interviews

Towards the end of last year, there were two visits to Imrali with the peoples leader Abdullah Ocalan. Since then, there have been many discussions regarding a possible solution to the Kurdish question and a general democratization. Do you see that we are currently moving towards a solution? And what role has your global campaign played in the current developments so far?

First of all, I salute Rêber Apo¹, who is the pioneer of the most meaningful resistance in history. As you mentioned, two meetings have taken place with Rêber Apo at the end of the past year – first on October 23rd and then again on December 28th. In the course of the second meeting, Rêber Apo was able to issue a message through the delegation that met with him, to the public, that was more comprehensive than what we learned from the first meeting. In the first meeting it was his nephew who came to him. And the meeting was considered as a family meeting. But in the second meeting, it was the delegation of the DEM Party.

There was a public statement, and Rêber Apo’s message was conveyed. Afterwards, the delegation took up its work. They met with the headquarters of the parliamentary parties and met with several further individuals and organizations, and at the end, they gave a public statement summarizing what results they had reached so far and gave partial information about the content of the meeting with Rêber Apo through the press.

We have followed these developments carefully and are trying to understand the messages of Rêber Apo and what the delegation of the DEM Party has achieved. Apart from what is reflected in the press, no further information is available to us. Comrade Cemil Bayik has already elaborated on this. We have not received any call, message, or request officially until now. We do not know the content of the ongoing discussions. Just like the public, like everyone else, we are trying to understand the situation by looking at the official statements made in the press and to draw lessons from Rêber Apo’s messages.

Many things are being stated, and a lot of discussions are going on, but there is no change in practice. A discussion has arisen. This is of great value and importance, and our leadership has issued a statement accordingly. We value these discussions, are following them closely, and, as we have publicly stated, we are approaching this responsibly. After all, our chief negotiator is Rêber Apo. We have always been behind the process to be carried out by Rêber Apo, and we will also be behind it now. We will implement his decisions. But one has to highlight that apart from words we don’t see anything in practice. There is no change in the discourse or practice of the ruling circles, especially the AKP. They don’t take the whole thing seriously and act as if they’re ecstatic. That in fact simply reveals how frivolously they. This is due to the government. The words and statements of the ruling circles, especially Tayyip Erdogan and the AKP circles, direct the press.

Of course there are also some in other parties that provoke as well; their practices continue. Generally speaking, there has been no change in practice. The attacks against the people, the arrests, and the forceful appointing of trustees continue. They are raising prices, and the oppression and exploitation continue. There has been no change in Imrali regarding the situation of Rêber Apo. The fact that there have been meetings is a result of the struggle carried out on the basis of the global freedom campaign under the name of ‘Freedom for Abdullah Ocalan, a Political Solution to the Kurdish Question‘. That is something we have expressed and evaluated before. This is a great success. A breach was opened in the total isolation. There was a statement of our leadership emphasizing the importance of opening this breach. But still there is no practice beyond that. Any changes made by the ruling circles regarding the situation of Rêber Apo, regarding the change in the situation in Imrali, have not been reflected in the public opinion. We have no such information.

So, of course, the isolation continues. The Imrali system continues as it is. Rêber Apo’s current conditions continue. There has been no change in his conditions. Sure, there are discussions, the delegation of the DEM Party held talks, and the political parties in Turkey made statements. Of course, we see these as meaningful and important. But these are just discussions. There is no practice that matches the optimism expressed in the discussions. For example, there is no information on whether the parliament is working on the issue or not, whether legal arrangements are being made or not. Devlet Bahceli made a call, and many circles joined this call. It was said that Rêber Apo would come to the parliament and speak there in the DEM Party group. But how will he come from Imrali? May he come. Who is preventing him from coming? Have those who called for him to come to ensure his arrival done anything? Are they taking any initiative? Are they making any efforts? It doesn’t reflect on us in practice. That is to say, they want and expect Rêber Apo to do whatever they want without changing anything. This won’t happen.

No one should say that the PKK is against it. There is nothing like that. The movement and the people as a whole are following the process carefully. But those who make these calls, those who want something to happen, are not practicing what it requires. Rêber Apo said that if conditions are created, if opportunities are created, if the torture and isolation system of Imrali is abandoned, if he reaches free living and working conditions, he can play a role. What can he do in the current situation? How will he make a statement? He cannot say anything. What he says cannot be published in its current state; anyone who publishes it is committing a criminal offense. He would be arrested; they are even confiscating Rêber Apo’s prison writings. In that respect, there is no effort from their side. However, practice is necessary. If those who make these calls and create optimism are serious, then they must also take the practical steps that their words require. They must create the conditions for Rêber Apo to be able to speak in the DEM Party’s group. They must pave the way for him to do politics. They must provide him with the conditions to live and work freely. Put an end to the torture and isolation system of Imrali.

We are not saying that everything is negative, but especially those who make these calls, those who are responsible for this, if they really want to change something, then they must take the practical steps required by it.

Other than that, it is a struggle. The Kurdish people and their international friends have developed a struggle within the global freedom campaign for the physical freedom of Rêber Apo and the solution of the Kurdish question. This must continue in all four parts of Kurdistan and all over the world. There must not be the slightest weakness. Through struggle, those who speak words but do not fulfill their promises can be forced to take steps in practice. It is clear that everything is won and created through struggle. We must struggle, we must struggle more, and we must struggle with more creative methods in order to achieve the necessary results.

Of course the global freedom campaign has already brought upon important results. We predicted that this would be the case. We said that there would be lasting developments in line with the goals of the freedom campaign. The way is paved for this. But in order to realize it, we must struggle more, struggle more widely, and struggle more effectively. I salute all those who are participating in this once again and call on our people and international friends to further strengthen this struggle.

Why is this happening now? There has been a similar point before, but back then the Turkish government opted for escalation – what’s the difference today?

Fifteen to twenty years ago, when the legal process was going on, when Rêber Apo was making defenses, he evaluated these situations in his prison writings. He listed individually what would happen if this or that step was taken. And what do we see today? That it has happened exactly as he said at the time. No one should approach Imrali lightly. The simple words of some simple people have no value. People are gradually realizing this. There are some lumpen people who try to create confusion and chaos. There is no point in that.

How did this happen? We are struggling. The PKK, under the leadership of Rêber Apo, has fought for this cause for more than fifty years. To change this mentality and policy and the system it has led to. It was the anti-Kurdish, fascist, colonialist, genocidal mentality and politics. It has been more than forty years that we have been waging a war for freedom without interruption. Now we entered the 10th year of the total fascist, genocidal special war attacks of the AKP administration on the basis of their so-called ‘Collapse Plan‘. Against these, we, as a movement for freedom and as a people, waged total resistance. Those who prepared the plan and tried to put it into practice could not achieve their goals, and they themselves collapsed. The fascist AKP-MHP government that tried to implement it came to the point of collapse. Whatever it did, by marketing all the means of Turkey, by getting support from everywhere, from NATO, China, and Russia, from everywhere, by using all kinds of weapons, by ignoring all rules of law and morality, by committing thousands of war crimes, it still failed in its attacks.

The heroic Kurdish guerrillas in Zap, Metina, and Avashin, the Medya Defense Zones², and all over Kurdistan gave the greatest examples of heroic resistance in history. Kurdish women and youth fight day and night with great consciousness and organization. The Kurdish people and their international friends have been in struggle in the four parts of Kurdistan and abroad. Since October 10, 2023, this struggle has been a planned action based on the physical freedom of Rêber Apo and the solution of the Kurdish question. The result was breaking the absolute isolation as it completed its first year and entered its second year. Seeing that it was collapsing, the forces turned to looking for a way out. MHP Chairman Devlet Bahceli was at the forefront of this. Because he is the one who led the war. This is quite clear and understandable. People were wondering why the initiative came from Bahceli. It wasn’t going to come from the rent-seekers, it was going to come from whoever was fighting. He fought, got no results, became desperate, and now he is looking for another solution. This is one dimension of it. They have no more power to continue these attacks. They are not in a position to achieve their goals.

One has also not to forget that there are the results of the Third World War that has been going on in the Middle East for 35 years. This war is always the subject of evaluation. It started with the Gulf crisis, and after the dissolution of the Soviet Union, the US, on the basis of the strategy of the New World Order, has been carrying out attacks for nearly twenty years to seize the Gulf and establish control over it. For more than ten years, almost fifteen, they have been carrying out attacks to establish control in the Eastern Mediterranean. The war takes place between the forces of the global monopolist capitalist system and the nation state forces of the status quo in the region that emerged out of the First World War. It started with the fall of the Baath government in Iraq, the center of status quoism, and on October 7, 2023, with the war in Gaza, it reached a new stage. After that, it was more or less obvious how developments would unfold, because those who carried out these attacks had already declared their goals beforehand. They had called it the Greater Middle East Project and made many statements, but they did not fill in their words, and many things remained vague. Then there was the announcement in the course of the G20 summit in India. A new energy and trade route from India to Greece was announced to be built. And so it started to take concrete shape. First they took control of the Gulf, around Saudi Arabia. Then they started taking control of the Eastern Mediterranean under the leadership of Israel. One could say that they are cleaning the road. They neutralized Hamas in this course, and we said at the time that Lebanon would follow and that Syria would come next. Because they have declared that it would be part of their road project. And it really happened like that. When the first year was completed, there was the war with Lebanon-Hezbollah. It was indeed a surprising war. Everyone expected that war to be much longer, but Hezbollah was dealt a very heavy blow in a very short time. Israel, which had the full support of the US and Europe, was very well prepared and struck effectively. When Hezbollah suffered a heavy blow, it was a blow to Iran as well. When Trump won the November 6 elections, the US administration had the ground for a deal with Russia. They made the necessary agreement in three weeks. 20 days after the US election, they launched the attack on the Assad regime from Aleppo. And in a week, the Syrian Baath government fell and collapsed.

After the First World War, the Arab pillar of the nation state status quo in the Middle East collapsed. And now solely Turkey and Iran are left. Turkey and Iran were already the regional hegemonic powers of this status quo. So, now it is the turn of the destruction of the Turkish and Iranian nation state status quo. The system will turn against them and attack them. Iran already feels this closely and is trying to develop measures accordingly. Turkey’s deep state leadership has also sensed this. Devlet Bahceli, saying that the question of the survival of the state has come to the fore, started these discussions on October 1st. He made calls regarding internal unity and said that in any other way Turkey will collapse. That was true. Turkey will indeed collapse if it does not change itself, if it does not democratize, if it does not solve its problems.

Just as the Arab nation states collapsed, the fate of the Turkish Republic will be no different. The only thing that can prevent this is democratization, and that goes via the solution of the Kurdish question. Therefore, calls were made to Rêber Apo for unity, and he was accepted as an interlocutor. We attach importance to this. To be so outspoken all of a sudden, coming from a party and its chairman like Devlet Bahceli, the chairman of the MHP, who led the genocidal war against the Kurds ideologically and militarily in the first place. But the question is what the result will be.

We said that those who oppose this in Iraq would be dealt with, and Cyprus would be next, and it was. The islands are being discussed, and there are already discussions on Cyprus. Turkey has taken a stance against this. They appointed a trustee in the Mediterranean. This is also connected with this process. The appointment of trustees in Akdeniz at such a time is also connected to the fact that it is Cyprus’ turn. They are looking for a measure; they cannot stay. But the connection to Cyprus is through Mersin. They want to consolidate the front line or the position. They are preparing for war, according to themselves. Of course that won’t produce a solution. There is no solution with that.

This is how this process has come to the agenda for those who govern Turkey. Will they approach it correctly? Will they make enough correct assessments? Will they be able to show political flexibility to solve the problems? Will the democratic forces be able to lead the process? We will see this in the near future. Rêber Apo also took the initiative here.

To come back to the situation in Turkey in more concrete terms – how do you assess the delegation’s efforts? How do you understand the government’s stance? And especially in the context you just mentioned, what does it mean when peoples leader Abdullah Ocalan says that he is ready to play his role if the conditions are met?

The members of the delegation are experienced. They have indeed carried out a prudent effort in the face of provocations in various media and by some irresponsible circles. And they announced their results, seemingly being positively optimistic, but they also expressed serious concerns. Their concerns were also seen during the negotiations. The AKP wing is causing the most concern. It seems as if they are not taking a serious approach. The rhetoric of Tayyip Erdogan and some AKP leaders expresses this. There is a constant threatening situation. He wants to create such an atmosphere, wants to paint such an image for his own circles as if he would be the second conqueror, that he is victorious in this war. He wants to create a perception. However, this is not the reality. It is not only wrong, but also dangerous.

What we have seen from the delegation or from the discussions that took place after the delegation’s meeting with Rêber Apo and during the talks with the political parties has shown, first of all, that this set the agenda of discussion in Turkey. Rightly or wrongly, it still is positive. Because it’s a discussion regarding democratization and its key, the Kurdish question. And the chief interlocutor of the Kurdish question is Rêber Apo. It is appropriate for the Kurdish question to be on the discussion agenda in such a situation.

We have experience from previous processes. We are not experiencing such a process for the first time. In fact, in the past, Rêber Apo and our party have declared many uniliteral ceasefires; there have been similar processes, there has been hope, and there has been despair, but it didn’t bring up a solution, and so we have come to today. So it is not a new situation; we have a wealth of experience. Compared to the past, many social and political circles and political parties here are closer to each other. To a certain point they may have a better understanding of the process than before. There is no complete change of mentality or policy, but they say that this situation cannot go on like this, that change is needed. This is good; there seems to be agreement on this point, but they are not all the same. For example, during the talks, when statements were made, the AKP delegation said: “We had just a little chat.” No one else who met with the delegation said that. There are still statements coming from AKP circles that use the old language that is based on annihilation and slander. Saying: “We’re going to bury them.” This is a language far from reality. Other parties are more consistent. For example, the CHP’s approach has been more consistent.

There are fears that the AKP will abuse this situation for elections. Especially the CHP, but also other parties, are very sensitive about this issue. They immediately bring it to the forefront. Of course, they have a point. But this is nothing that can be instrumentalized for elections. The solution of the Kurdish question, the democratization of Turkey, making legal and constitutional arrangements, and Turkey going through a reformist change – this cannot be abused for votes. That is nothing one can just put on the agenda to snatch some votes. That would be a very simple and manipulative approach. That approach will not bring them votes. It will not affect the society. On the contrary, it would be seen as opportunism and lead to a loss.

This process has also revealed the fact that the Kurdish question has been perpetuated by a conflict. The 100-year-old problem has become a 100-year-old conflict. Kurds were pitted against each other, and politics was carried out through this. The system of global capitalist modernity has benefited various states and political forces within it. They profited from the Kurdish conflict, the Kurdish question. But there are also many rent-seekers in Turkey. There are so many people who benefited from this war. This war has been going on for forty years. It would be good if it were investigated what these people were doing and expose them to the public. That would be an important task of the press. We have seen this in the so-called right-wing and nationalist circles. In fact, the CHP was very much present in the social nationalist circles as well. There were quite a few people who benefited from the Kurdish question and the conflict that was caused through it.

The Kurdish question is both complex and simple. It is an issue of mentality and politics. It has nothing to do with material interests and not so much with political and economic problems as some people think. It is an issue of mentality, a fascist, colonialist, and genocidal mentality. The mentality that strives to deny and destroy the existence of the Kurdish people, and the politics that this mentality leads to, creates this issue. Seeing the Kurdish reality, understanding that the Kurdish people have rights just as everyone has rights, just as everyone has democratic rights, and implementing such a change in mentality and pushing forward democratization would immediately solve the Kurdish question. There would be no basis left for such a fascist, genocidal torture system against Rêber Apo. There would be no need to say such words, to produce such policies. Such a mentality and policy would solve it immediately. But if the current mentality and policy are insisted on – the existence of a people of 50 million is being denied and is under attack, all the means of Turkey are utilized for military, extermination, and ideological attacks, and everything is abused for the annihilation of the Kurdish people, for the genocide of the Kurdish people – then it is a complex issue that cannot be resolved. They have been attacking for 100 years and have not succeeded. Kurds are neither a small community in quantity nor a weak people in quality. They are one of the most ancient peoples in history, coming from the Neolithic period. One of the oldest people of Mesopotamia, with one of the strongest cultural backgrounds and values. How are you going to destroy these people? You came from Central Asia in tribes, on horseback, sword in hand, and settled in Anatolia. Thanks to whom were you able to come here? It was thanks to the Kurds. You came through Kurdistan, and you got so far with the support of Kurds. If you now try to cut the branch you rode on, what will become of you? This is the situation of the current government in Turkey. This is the situation of the government that wants to destroy the Kurds.

Neither can the Kurdish people be wiped out through assimilation and cultural and physical genocide, nor can the Turkish state and Turkish society wipe out the Kurdish existence itself. Because their very own existence is based on the back of the Kurds. They made Anatolia their home with the Kurdish alliance. Through them have they been able to form a nation there. If they wipe out the Kurds, it is like they are cutting their own feet off, and then they destroy their own foundation. That’s why Rêber Apo has repeatedly said. There can be no Turks without Kurds and no Kurds without Turks. Their co-existence is so intertwined and interdependent. If they don’t realize this, if they insist on saying that everyone within the borders of Turkey, within the borders of the Turkish Republic, is a Turk, and attack everyone that is objecting to this, then they will lose all power, all the means. Then they won’t be able to succeed in anything and will lose the power to solve the Kurdish question or any other existing problem. They cannot solve the Kurdish problem by force of arms or by genocide. It can only be solved with a change in mentality, a revolution, a change in policy. If they democratize just a little, if they see the differences, if they accept that Kurds are a people like Turks, that they have democratic rights, that they should live freely, then it could be solved at a moment’s notice. That is why Rêber Apo says he will solve it in a week. Because it is a problem that can be solved at this level with a change in mentality. Therefore it is necessary to criticize and change this monist, nationalist, racist, and fascist mentality and politics. It is necessary to shift the direction of the discussions there.

This is how Rêber Apo perceived it already fifteen, twenty years ago, and why he evaluated various possibilities. He predicted where the outcome would go according to various policies. He is also in constant follow-up. Therefore, he knows the developments well; he foresees and predicts them before anyone else. He develops an attitude and policy accordingly. He saw the results of the struggle. Yes, our struggle may not have led to the great military victory, but it has destroyed their ‘Collapse Plan.’ Those who thought they could force the Kurdish freedom movement to its knees with a military attack ended up collapsing themselves.

There is the development of the Third World War in the Middle East. Israel is becoming a new hegemonic power in the region, while Iran and Turkey were already hegemonic powers before. In Iraq, the Baathist government fell, and now also in Syria, the Baath power has fallen. The nation state system in Iraq and Syria has dissolved and collapsed. Iran and Turkey remained as the main status quo nation state. One can say that in this Third World War, the nation state status quo is being dismantled. It had no chance of success, and now it has been defeated. Both Turkey and Iran have been defeated in this war. But how they will bring it to a conclusion will be determined in the process to come. In other words, what kind of change and transformation they will experience will be determined.

Rêber Apo also evaluated these. In this context, especially when Devlet Bahceli made his statement and the environment in Turkey seemed open to this, Rêber Apo took the initiative and started developing a process. By evaluating this environment and conditions, he said that if favorable conditions are created, he can move the developments surrounding the Kurdish question from the grounds of conflict and war to the legal and political grounds. He wants to stop the conflict and war and pave the way for democratic politics and a legal solution and to develop a process that will realize a peaceful and democratic solution to the Kurdish question. “I have the power”, he said. “I can develop such a solution; I can play a role here.” This is how he responded to the call made to him; he took the initiative.

The declaration made by the delegation on behalf of Rêber Apo reflects his attitude and the work that he carries out with hope, faith, and patience. It reveals how assertive, faithful, and determined he is. There is great self-confidence, sincerity, consistency, and a demand to work. He really wants to develop a process that will realize the solution of the Kurdish question on the basis of the democratization of Turkey and even the democratization of the Middle East. There is an intense effort in this direction. But of course, Rêber Apo will only be able to do this if the conditions for this are met. Who has to create these conditions? Those who keep the Imrali system alive, who maintain it, they have to meet the conditions. Who created the system of torture and genocide of Imrali and who has been maintaining it for 26 years? They need to abolish this system and prepare the conditions for Rêber Apo.

To those who say that the PKK should abolish itself: First of all, abolish the system of torture, isolation, and genocide in Imrali, the system that has brought Kurdistan and Turkey to a deadlock. The conditions must be created so that people can come, work and discuss. After that, one can have a look at whether the PKK will be dissolved or not. It is not the case that the PKK can simply be dissolved; all hell would break loose. The PKK is nothing of one state or another. What are they thinking? They would simply collapse the firmament on the people. Also, how will the Kurdish people’s free democratic life and participation in Turkey’s democracy be realized? An organization for this needs to develop.

The priority is to pave the way and create the conditions for Rêber Apo to freely engage in politics. In other words, the Imrali system must be abolished. This is necessary. But there is no such effort, no work from the governmental side. In the Imralie environment, they expect Rêber Apo to act as a servant and do whatever they want. This is not possible. As Demirel used to say – it is against the nature of things. Those who keep this system alive have to do this step for the process, for Rêber Apo to play his role. What will make them do this? The struggle will make them do it. The meeting on October 23 was a direct result of the struggle, and so was the meeting on December 28. They emerged as the results of the struggle in the framework of the global freedom campaign. The struggle of the Kurdish people and their international friends is the only force that will lead those who maintain the Imrali system to change it and create development. Our people, the Kurds, the democratic forces of Turkey, women, and especially the youth should be very well aware of this. No one should expect that a solution, an agreement, will be made at the table, signatures will be signed, and everything will be solved. No one should think that the struggle is over. There is no such thing. We are entering into a more complex, much more intense process of struggle. In this respect, much stronger organization, unity, and struggle are needed.

There is a necessity for much more sensitivity regarding all kinds of tricks and games against fascist special war attacks. Therefore it is necessary to be organized and be united. One has to be very sensitive and cautious, and we must struggle until the end. The struggle must not stop. It is absolutely necessary to understand this process accurately, and accordingly it is inevitable that the solution will be achieved through our struggle. It will be through the struggle of the people. Therefore, we must assume responsibility, take on tasks, and lead this struggle. We must develop this in a sensitive manner and with the right ways and methods.

In this the Kurdish youth and the women must play the pioneering role, and the Kurdish people must mobilize not only themselves but also their international friends. It is the democratic, left-socialist forces that have to play the most decisive role. Rêber Apo has also made calls on this issue. Turkey’s democratic and left-socialist forces should take upon their responsibility and lead this process. This is about the democratization of Turkey, a democratization on the level of a revolution. All the left, socialist, and democratic forces of Turkey have to embrace this process more than anyone else. They should unite their struggles with the Kurdish people, youth, and women and take responsibility for the development of this process as a process of democratization in Turkey. Like this, the process will move forward. The Kurdish problem cannot be solved without the democratization of Turkey. There will be no solution in Turkey. Kurdish freedom and Turkish democracy are completely dependent on each other.

The ruling circles spit big notes such as “We defeated them!”, “We broke them!”, and “We will bury them!” This throwing around of empty slogans must stop. We are trying to show the sensitivity and attention required by the process. We really want this process, which Rêber Apo wants to develop with enthusiasm and excitement, to progress and be realized. We are making any effort for this. But the society in Turkey and those circles must know that this will not work with these threats. Nothing will happen with those threats. The PKK leadership made a statement on this issue. We are always ready for war, and we are ready for peace. They should not play with the emotions and feelings of the Kurdish people and freedom forces. If they really want some change, if they truly love Turkey… In this period of collapse, these efforts of Rêber Apo are the last chance for the salvation of Turkey. If this is not utilized, there can no longer be such initiatives. Kurds do not lack options. The struggle over Kurdistan has intensified. There are many actors, not only the Turkish state. Kurds are related to everyone at one level or another. Kurdistan is the center of the struggle. No one can defeat the Kurds.

Rêber Apo strives for a solution based on the democratization of Turkey, and we are supporting this. A democratized Turkey will lead to a democratized Middle East. And a democratized Middle East will lead to progress in democratic and free life for humanity. We support this because we believe in this. It should not be assumed that this is the only option, that we are in dire need. In this respect, no one should hold us responsible if there are negative consequences. Patiently, carefully, and sensitively, as a movement and as a people, we are acting in accordance with the requirements of these things. Despite all the attacks by the ruling circles. They are arresting so many people, are forcibly appointing so many trustees, have developed so many conflicts with the CHP, are putting Turkey into different conflicts, and are constantly waging war. The war has never stopped. The war continues with full intensity in the Medya Defense Zones and in all parts of Kurdistan. There is not the slightest withdrawal. Everyone should be aware of this.

Since you have already mentioned the Medya Defense Zones and the ongoing war, what is the current situation there? And what has the guerrilla resistance contributed to the processes you described?

The primary force driving Devlet Bahceli and other political circles in Turkey to form such a call or idea is the Kurdish people’s struggle for freedom. This is certain. At the center, at the foundation and at the vanguard of this struggle is the sacrificial guerrilla war of struggle. Since August 15, 1984, it has been continuing in a heroic line. This struggle continued on the heroic line in 2024, centered on the areas of Zap and Metina. With the comrades Asya and Rojger, the guerrilla once again showed everyone, friend and foe alike, that it has the power and capability to hit all kinds of Turkish targets, even in the center of Ankara. In 2024, Turkey added the KDP to the already existing AKP-MHP alliance, and than they added Iraq. They entered northern Iraq with the claim that they would eradicate everything that something to do with the Kurdish question and the PKK. Tayyip Erdogan himself said this. Throughout the year, they entered everywhere with armored troops, carried out all kinds of attacks with the leadership and support of the Iraqi army and the KDP peshmerga. They said they were “closing the lock”. For four years, this army has not been able to take down even one position. The whole army is attacking with everything. The guerrilla rises its resistance against this in it dozens, hundreds of positions.

The war rages not only in the Medya Defense Zones, it is in every area of northern Kurdistan. The war is not only in the mountains, but in the plains, in the city, everywhere. At different levels, against different targets, it continues according to their characteristics. Just yesterday, there was some criticism as to why there is no “war on terror”. I think the Minister of Defense replied, saying: “Can’t you see how many bombardments we have carried out? What more are we going to do?” In two days, there were 46 air strikes on the Medya Defense Zones. Not to mention the war on the other side. He asked: “What more can we do?” They can’t launch a ground operation. All their talks about the “closed lock”, that’s all a story. They are stuck in the mountains like in a quagmire. The Kurdish mountains exhausts them, and the guerrilla crushes them. Without Iraqi and KDP support, it would sweep them all away in a day. This is the truth of the matter.

The war and the clashes continue. Our central headquarters command and the press reflect the results of it on a daily basis. This is the situation. They are in a very difficult situation. There is nothing they can do. They themselves got stuck in a deadlock. This is the situation of the colonial and genocidal invaders in the Medya Defense Zones.

The guerrilla has a lot of power, and still a lot of potential. The areas are broad. The opportunities to renew and develop itself, to increase the grounds for war, to change the targets, to improve its style and tactics are many. In the coming period, if the war continues, it is necessary to see and expect that all this will further develop. Never to forget, it was the heroic guerrilla resistance in the Medya Defense Zones, particularly surrounding the area of Zap that led to the emergence of this situation and the collapse of the ‘Collapse Plan’. The guerrilla created the ground for Rêber Apo to take the initiative. For this reason and on this occasion, I once again salute the guerrilla, congratulate their successes and commemorate all the heroic martyrs with respect and gratitude.

At this point, I would also like to return to the situation in Syria. The question remains as to how things will continue there. While most eyes are focused on Damascus, there is still an intense war going on in northern Syria, particularly at Tishrin Dam at the moment. The Turkish state has just bombed civilians there again, killing several people. What can you tell us about this war?

We learned from the press that the 6 people were martyred, and that 21 were wounded. There are daily attacks against the people there. And there is a great resistance in Tishrin since weeks. Indeed, the peoples of North and East Syria are making history. Under the leadership of the Kurdish people, they are waging an epic struggle, an heroic self-defense. They are doing this with great courage and sacrifice, and they will succeed. The way forward for North and East Syria is clear. The Democratic Autonomous Administration of North and East Syria is the power that will be a model and be effective in the structuring of the new Syria. Therefore, this struggle, the blood shed, the courage and sacrifice shown will triumph, yield results, and will not be in vain. I believe that both our people of Rojava and all the peoples of North and East Syria know this much better, I salute and congratulate their heroic resistance and commemorate all the heroic martyrs with respect and gratitude, by commemorating Bave Teyar.

The attack on Afrin attack was a crucial prelude to the attacks against now. The invasion attack on Afrin, that was launched on January 20, 2018, should not be taken lightly. Afrin resisted for two months against the NATO-backed attacks carried out by the Turkish Republic with all its might. It was a heroic resistance of honor. Liberation forces were created, that struggle for Afrins freedom, and their war still continues. I salute this great resistance once again on its 7th anniversary and commemorate the martyrs with respect and gratitude. I salute everyone fighting for the liberation and freedom of Afrin and wish them success. Afrin is a Kurdish city which has a very unique character. It is an area where anything can be done and any courageous sacrifice can be made for its liberation. The struggle for Afrin will never stop.

After Afrin, the Turkish state occupied Gire Spi and Serekaniye. Now it is also trying to occupy further areas, particularly Manbij and Shahba, with its own paramilitary forces and the so-called Syrian National Army. It is in an alliance with HTS. But the main thing is the occupation of the Turkish Republic. There are discussions about how Syria will be restructured, and what will be established after the Assad regime. This discussion is always over the SDF and the situation of the Democratic Autonomous Administration of North and East Syria west of the Euphrates. However, there is an occupying power in Syria. The Turkish state, the AKP government. It is the occupier in Afrin. There are Turkish flags and Turkish schools. It is governed like a district of Turkey. Gire Spi is like that, and they are trying to govern Serekaniye like that. There is an occupation. Those who talk about what Syria will become must first take a stance against the Turkish occupation.

They are constantly launching new attacks. The SNA is an artificially created story. They are all fleeing and scattering. It can be seen in the news. The forces of SDF, fighters of YPG and YPJ launched a bunch of attacks, and the gangs and mercenaries of SNA that were targeted were devastated and scattered. Immediately the Turkish army stepped in. It started to launch non-stop air strikes, with both helicopters and warplanes, then again UCAV’s. It has directed all its technical power there. Supposedly the SNA is fighting. This is just an artificially story, no such army is fighting. The fighting force is the Turkish state.

The Turkish state is attacking Tishrin, Reqqa and Tebqa. It has now passed Rojava Kurdistan and is attacking to occupy Syria. The Turkish state has commanded the fall of the Assad regime. It ensured the fall of the government of a UN member state. Doesn’t this impose a responsibility on Turkey? Of course there is. No one discusses or evaluates this. It is wrong to attribute too much role to Turkey in the fall of the current government in Syria. Rêber Apo called the role of the Turkish state in the conspiracy “guardianship”. In this last collapse of the Baath regime in Syria, the role of the AKP government was that of a jailer. It also wants to take ISIS members. It wants to save them. It wants to use them elsewhere. It has always pursued a blackmail policy based on these gangs or on the refugees. The AKP government has been prolonging its life and surviving with these policies for years. They say that if Erdogan takes ISIS, he has already revived and mobilized. There are such rumors and it is very much reflected in the press.

Tayyip Erdogan deceived and motivated his own public opinion as if he had won a victory in Syria. He declared a false victory. But no one is evaluating what the cost of this is for Turkey. That will be seen in the near future. They will see that it is very heavy, that Turkey is paying a very expensive price for Tayyip Erdogan’s policies. It is both an occupying and an aggressive force. The force called SNA has already failed to do what it was supposed to do. Now they want to do it with the power of the Turkish army and take Tishrin. Why? That is the power plant there. Erdogan has his eye on economic resources. They either want to seize it or destroy it. They attack all the means of life of the society, like wheat granaries, water tanks etc. And they also do not hesitate to massacre civilians. The civilian population is defending themselves valiantly. This is connected to Afrin. They paved the way for the occupation in Afrin. No one raised a voice. On the contrary, they supported it. And now it is massacring so many civilians. It is committing war crimes. Again they are silent. The world says nothing. Supposedly, he will take it and seize an economic power. And he will have won a victory. He will have waged war. He will have waged a war and won a victory. The war in Tishrin has reached such a position. It seems that it is an event with much wider political consequences. It is often seen as a conflict in such a narrow area, but the violence of the war is very high, and its political impact is very high. It will probably determine the balance of power in the discussions on the restructuring of Syria.

They already claimed they had taken the Tishrin dam, but it was journalists, it were Nazim Dashtan and Cihan Bilgin, who exposed their lie. Therefore they murdered them. The murdered them and hoped that no one else dared to speak up. They arrested those who stood up for them. Just recently they arrested six journalists in Turkey because they were defending Nazim Dashtan and Cihan Bilgin, because they were exposing these war policies.

Is there anything else you would like to emphasize in conclusion?

Attacks against the Medya Defense Zones continue, and so do the attacks against the civilian population in North and East Syria, namely at the Tishrin dam. Day by day the Turkish state is committing war crimes. Meanwhile the forceful appointments of trustees to municipalities and to the Istanbul Bar Association continue. There is no end in sight regarding the waves of arrests. Tayyip Erdogan used to say: “I come by elections – the will of the people.” The will of the people has been forgotten. He now considers whatever is in his own interest, whatever will be his gain, to be permissible. There is a situation of constant attack. And while they are pushing all this forward, they show that Rêber Apo has taken the initiative and is making efforts to appease.

There does not seem to be any change. One would think that they think we have no idea about politics! On the one hand, they talk about peace and even put pressure on Rêber Apo to quickly become the creator of peace. On the other hand, they escalate the war on all levels. They continue the attacks by developing and spreading them. Is this the way it is? There will be no change? Do they have any credibility in this way? This is why public opinion is skeptical and concerned. In fact, we are propagandizing in order to destroy this anxiety and suspicion. Because we cannot get anywhere by looking with anxiety and suspicion. Of course there should always be sensitivity, but the important thing is to struggle, to develop something new through struggle. They say that nothing changes. We need to make this government unable to carry out those attacks through struggle so that we can pave the way for change. This government will not do anything. The struggle will do it, democratic forces will do it. We will pave the way for change by forcing the government. Change is crucial. Turkey has entered a process of change. Change must be based on democratization. The one who makes democratic change are the pioneers. And those who cannot change and democratize will either be destroyed or overcome. In order not to be destroyed or overcome, I call especially on democratic and socialist circles to understand the process correctly, to develop democratic change within their own structures, and to put themselves in a position to pioneer it, and I wish them success.

Footnotes: